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what is best in 1on1 pvp

Neither one is the "best" they are both very strong at it. In a fight between these, it'd depend on who's being used by the most skilled player.

Rogue/Cleric is very strong go invis and then normaly use prick and wounds very quick pvp quite boring

warrior/cleric still strong but has moe tanking abilty and pvps last longer this is the best pvp build ^_^

You clearly doesn't know how a skilled rogue/cleric fights. And, the warrior/cleric is the "best" pvp build in your opinion, which is not true for everyone.

There is no overall "best," just builds that are better in one area than another. For Rogue/Cleric you have semi-tanking capabilities paired with cleric sub, and overall a higher DPS and crits than warriors. With Warrior/Cleric you'll have a higher tanking ability (skins and bless spell), and a bit more versatility with the availability of 3 weapons (1h, 2h, and DA) compared to just 2 from Rogue (Daggers and Xbow). Rogue paired with Xbow also has the range advantage over Warrior/Cleric.

ya but range advantage gets greatly reduced because sprint assault gets further and further each time it levels up. Since they are both sub cleric neither in this case have moving/swing march to back up to get shots in while sprint assault is in cool down, the rogue will have a very hard time keeping range even with knock back.

but yes these builds are pretty even, vs each other how ever my money is still on the warrior but it is possible for the rogue to win just more often then not the warrior will. Rogue is how ever 20 times better at killing a blader then a warrior, s/s nuke snow or not, and a rogue can kill non shield using ints of the next degree with cross bow with ease (this includes spear nukers, wiz, bard).

Lol range is of no factor with speed pots. In 1on1 vs eachother I put my money on the warrior. Rogue pvp is overall with more risk but when you take it you can also get a nice reward. Warrior finish the job slow but inevitable. Where rogue fights are more fast but like said before with more risk.

A point that should be considered to group pvp IMO is that rogues hit like sh1t without extreme or DD, unless they get a prick crit which still doesnt hit to much. The moment a rogue puts on DD or xbow especially in the larger scale fights hes dead either by a direct hit or splash.

i got a str cleric but i dont know what sub to chose now he only got 950k sp and i already quited farm realy boring xD

You said that range is of no factor because it has never been actually used against you. Yeah, of course if you are with a 100% speed pot, range will matter somewhat less in a situation, but still will make difference. I mean, range is of factor, but not really in this case, a 1vs1 fight between a rogue and a warrior. Nevertheless, if both players in this fight are equally highly skilled and equipped I'd say it'd be a 50%/50% chance of winning. If they are not so skilled (even if still equally), I'd say that the warrior would have more chances of winning.


They don't hit like shit without CE/DD. They are still very strong. The only skill from warrior that really overpowers a rogue without CE/DD is maddening/daredevil, and they need to be up close and sacrifice 10% HP to use it, while a crossbow rogue would be far sniping. I'm not saying neither one is better, they are just different.

maddening is worse then beserker, only becomes better at daredevil (personal preference though, faster dmg i can get in a beserker and sheild bash in the time their guy is roaring at me, or i can just eat the dmg and go for a double stab + slash beserker by the time they only maddeninged + bash. Though a smart 2 hander would try turning rise next, most don't)

vs a rogue 1 hander will have the upper hand,
2 hander will be alot easier to kill for the rogue making the fight a bit more even, crits will the kill either

If it's a 1hander fighting a rogue, wouldn't the fight last forever or until someone crits repeatedly? The 1hander won't deal much damage and the rogue is sub cleric and therefore can heal itself, and the rogue won't be able to deal much damage either because 1h passives are awesome + extra defense from shield. I fail to see why a 1hander would have the upper hand as it's only bonus is the defense, at the cost of considerably lower damage. If they are using normal pots it'd be easier to end, but if they use grains, I guess it'd take a long time to finish.

Warrior/Cleric hands down

because the rogue almost can't kill the 1 hander but the 1 hander can kill the rogue, the rogue can't block at all either so every thing they don't knock back they have to eat. And of course if they try the knock down mortal wounds combo the second you stand up beserker before they can right click daggers desperate off because they are still semi stuck in animation themselves.

Both the Warrior and Rogue can use Bless, but the Warrior has an advantage with its Skins.

Yeah, but the warrior can't heal/cure while under skin, because if it switches to cleric the skin goes away.


I won't further comment this reply.


The 1hander almost can't kill the rogue too if it's smart, and we're talking about a sub cleric one. The rogue can knock down and knock back, while the 1hander can knock back and stun. The rogue can block and heal if it switches to cleric. I doubt berserker while the rogue is under DD will make you able to easily kill him, even if it's defense is low, because it has a massive amount of HP as a pure STR. It's more likely that you'll die if you don't knock him back or switch to cleric to heal when you get up, because when you are getting up the rogue will probably use a combo or prick and only then switch weapon/deactivate DD. If the rogue manages to get a crit while you are down and if you don't block any of the 3 hits of mortal wounds, I'm pretty sure you'll have a very hard time surviving, even if with skin/bless if you don't heal constantly.

Again, if you are fighting a skilled rogue, I'm pretty sure you'll have a damn hard time. But well, you'll hardly ever find any skilled rogue.

then again i do own a som sword, strs my lvl go down with one combo beserker double stab slash most of the time. But if both are skilled in this case getting a bless in will be harder with out knocking down/ stunning the enemy first, but i'm aggresive and rather use that time to finish them off before they can heal. You don't have to kill them off with beserker, you'll have time to hit them again because after mortal wound right clicking off DD which they still got daggers equipted and only a low chance to stun you. If they switch to cross bow after that other they still got a delay before they can knock back.

And higher lvls warriors i know like aventuris doens't loose to rogues at all and he uses 1 hander for the job, he has 2 hander too but 1 hander is just better suited to fight rogue.

I personally try to never let my opponent bless if i see them try, i'll shield/sprint to stop them and make them wait the cool down, and yes if they switch to cleric yes they can tank the dmg (Vindiction was fcking annoying about that when we'd fight she'd just switch to cleric and tank all the dmg and i basically couldn't kill her, of course over heals alone aren't going to kill me back either, I can wait and keep spamming knock back (of course this was back when she was 10 lvls higher and i didn't have a som, I could still kill her in rogue form even with DD or XTREME off))

smart xbow/cleric would just bind the warrior and use xbow :S
they cant do much to hit back, not sure if you can cure bind, no one cured it so far when i used it but I'm not sure if they just didn't bother or cant

edit: they can switch to shield to click off DD and shield trash to kb you... (if they got 10 warrior) or just switch to s/s and bind you, if you end up kbing the rogue, you cant chase after them for next attack

just heal yourself till you can bless when fighting 1h, bind and move away to bless

can just heal thru anyways, i think special pills cures it, you know no one ever uses bind on me to ever needed trying to see if i can cure it. I used bind all the time on cleric before i'd offer a warrior, gives me time to back up incase it got blocked, never saw any one cure it but i never saw any one try to either. hmm thats a good question can it be cured?

well bind can get through holy word so I like using it, but no one does it back so I'm not sure why lol

against warrior it is good, they got no range attacks, even if they are healing while oyu are attacking, they'll be burning through mp fast enough that they wont be able to pull off a big warrior attack right away

Yup, another way.


Yeah, special pills and integrity cure bind if I recall it correctly.

I can use any argument i want, i'm arguing for the shear fun of it. Neither of us truly care about the subject (though i do love 1 hander the best of the 3 weapons).

less then spectacular gear
http://www.rev6.com/player.asp?id=1695020
i've seen him fight several rogue/clerics his lvl and higher and win, they even tried the combo i don't remeber off the top of my head but some dude in TFS tried it on us while we were trading, but though he did use knock first after standing up, i vigor right as a rogue combos me so i got enough hp for the beserker, (crits still leathal on me) He's warrior/warlock though not warrior/cleric but the rogues are all sub cleric, there were several that tried to kill him, but he also dind't debuff them or switch off warrior at all. He just iron skinned and went at them.

We are arguing to get to a valid conclusion, am I wrong? Therefore we need valid arguments. And I love debating.


Well, I don't really understand what's the point of this story, and I can't understand the relation of the part I put in bold to the rest of the story too. But, this Aventuris is a warrior/warlock? And he could kill rogues with only skin and 1handed? Hmm, I don't understand nevertheless why that story is actually relevant here. We can't base anything on a random happening.

I thought a little more, and the main advantage of a warrior over a rogue is the very fast weapon switching/attacking/disabling while rogue crossbow skills which are their only way of actually disabling are somewhat very slow when compared to a warrior. If the warrior is used correctly, it'll leave almost no opening for the rogue to do anything except to heal.

So, yeah, changed my mind, warrior/cleric actually is better at 1vs1 PvP in general, as long as it's farmed with more than one weapon (preferably all 3). Rogue/cleric is very close to the warrior/cleric anyways.

the point is saying that the 1 hander has the upper hand vs rogues in most cases

1h vs Rogue/clerics in capped and FF PvP is nothing more than a pot fight. 1h dmg alone isn't enough to kill any pure str except pure str euros paired with bard sub. Try to kill a pure str with 1h alone and it'll be nothing but a pot fight; 1h is only good for tanking i.e., ints through snow shield, but for dmg it's not so good. You'd only need 1h/shield to sprint after kbing with your shield.

i have played both and i choose warrior.

the warrior is more balanced.

shouldn't be the KD from XBOW, to daggers then DD and that one combo everyone uses now work? I mean maybe less damage through shield, but it deals a whallop when opponent is KD :S. I'll say warrior/cleric because of it's variety of weapons giving it an advantage? That's probably if the rouge gets in bless and the enemy isn't on skin :S. Still, you can't really tell if it's not possible for the rouge cleric to dominate a warrior/cleric... possibilites.

Warrior/Warlock beats Rogue/Clerics in a heart beat.

i voted for warrior/cleric, but tis is the real answer

I stay with what I said because I experienced lv 90 tank vs rogue at my warrior. The range in 1on1 doesnt matter at all. 50% chance of winning? I suggest you look up some rogue vs tank videos. The kd + switching to DD wont kill a tank unless the rogue gets some extremely lucky crits. The tank still is able to kill the rogue without to much luck though.



And the tanks job is overpowering the dmg of a main dmg dealer? I know for sure a tank can tank really well with vital but also without it to some extent. However the dmg a rogue brings in my opinion is pretty low without DD. In pvp for exemple a rogue FF 90 could hit me for 34k. Yes this is alot. However this is a plain hit of 8,5k( no crit or desperate), which in my opinion is not alot at 30k hp. Where my DD could hit 7+7k=14k. Crossbow hits even less. In most partys we have both tambours + magic dance. So guard tambour cuts down the dmg of a rogue by alot, cause theres no fighting dance. I wont argue however that rogues are awesome interupters.

As dmg dealers rogues hit pretty low and are vurnelable

Maybe because your main is an int warlock/cleric its harder for you to fight rogues then tanks. But the only thing I worry about in group pvp when a rogue targets me are the kb's + kd's. In 1on1 they are dangerous in DD/Extreme, however when you have a +5 set its gonna be pretty hard for a rogue to kill you in a kd+DD combo. I read you said the rogue shouldnt cancel DD after kd right away. True a prick after this would finish a tank. However kb+sprint assault has a verry high interrupt chance.

Anyway, as you said both are really different. However when you compare them in 1on1 vs eachother the tank has the best chances. And in group pvp tanks can tank really well. Rogues however cant deal alot of dmg, but are great for annoying scorch/kb/kd. O crap I just read you changed your mind.. Dammn what a waste. Well hope this convinces you more . And foudre, theres no way a 1hander kills anything, its not possible.

As I've already said:
(...)So, yeah, changed my mind, warrior/cleric actually is better at 1vs1 PvP in general, as long as it's farmed with more than one weapon (preferably all 3). Rogue/cleric is very close to the warrior/cleric anyways.

Speed is of no factor in this fight, I somewhat agree with that, mainly because the warrior has sprint assault. Nevertheless, the warrior in my opinion would need considerable luck to survive a Knock Down + Mortal Wounds + Prick or Combo, because if any of these Crit, the damage outcome would be very high, and the warrior would need to rely on a shield block which is relatively low chance of working (less than ~ 30% with good shield + passive). If you knock him back when you get up, thus interrupting the "combo", he'll have time to turn off DD unless you get a stun with sprint assault (which is 33% at current cap), and if he succesfully turns off DD (by switching weapon or whatever) he'll have enough HP and time to heal. And, without vigor and HP grains, it'll be way harder for a warrior/cleric to survive this whole combo.


Since when is a rogue supposed to be a damage dealer without DD or CE? I stated he'd still do overall good damage without CE or DD, and able to tank with cleric skills. This is true, am I wrong? I know DareDevil is stronger than rogue skills without CE or DD.


With CE and DD they'll hit very hard, and any damage dealer is somewhat vulnerable, rogue is one of the less vulnerable damage dealers in my opinion, as it's a pure STR.


Where did I say that my main is a int warlock/cleric?

As I've already said above in this reply:
"(...)the warrior in my opinion would need considerable luck to survive a Knock Down + Mortal Wounds + Prick or Combo, because if any of these Crit, the damage outcome would be very high, and the warrior would need to rely on a shield block which is relatively low chance of working (less than ~ 30% with good shield + passive). If you knock him back when you get up, thus interrupting the "combo", he'll have time to turn off DD unless you get a stun with sprint assault (which is 33% at current cap), and if he succesfully turns off DD (by switching weapon or whatever) he'll have enough HP and time to heal. And, without vigor and HP grains, it'll be way harder for a warrior/cleric to survive this whole combo."

Nevertheless, again, "(...)warrior/cleric actually is better at 1vs1 PvP in general, as long as it's farmed with more than one weapon (preferably all 3). Rogue/cleric is very close to the warrior/cleric anyways.", and a skilled rogue/cleric still definitely has chances of winning.


Haha.